There were times when it seemed that questions were being addressed to the guardian, but were answered by the ghost. Is "ghostsplaining" a thing? It almost made me long for the "no time to explain" cutscene, where guardians and ghosts at least had a negotiable relationship.

The logical conclusion: Ghost is the protagonist. We're just there to shoot stuff and ferry him from door to door.

In b4 #so-and-sowasright.

Insofar that there was a story in this thing, I guess it was enjoyable. But yeah, #avateurwasright. Destiny 2 is where it's at, I hope! :D

The final fight was really fun though.

The final fight was fantastic - and AFTER it was done, I found out (by accident) how to get ammo for the axe. So now I want to run it again, to try it with an axe that actually works. :)

yep same here. i beat it on the first try, but died simultaneously. So i switched from stormcaller to sunsinger, and ended up beating it with a sliver of life left. So i actually went through it twice before figuring out how the ax worked.

SPOILER:

i noticed that when i hit Right Bumper to melee that i got 1 ammo that quickly went away, so i did the entire encounter in the center of the room just hitting RB RT RB RT RB. After the battle was over, i decided to explore for ghosts (there's at least 1 siva cluster in there btw), and that is when i figured out how the ax could be recharged with fire.

I basically was getting my ass handed to me by the dude and I ran back to where you start and I just happened to be standing right by the fire that recharged it. Lucky as hell :-)

The final fight was really fun though.

The final fight was fantastic - and AFTER it was done, I found out (by accident) how to get ammo for the axe. So now I want to run it again, to try it with an axe that actually works. :)

yep same here. i beat it on the first try, but died simultaneously. So i switched from stormcaller to sunsinger, and ended up beating it with a sliver of life left. So i actually went through it twice before figuring out how the ax worked.

SPOILER:

i noticed that when i hit Right Bumper to melee that i got 1 ammo that quickly went away, so i did the entire encounter in the center of the room just hitting RB RT RB RT RB. After the battle was over, i decided to explore for ghosts (there's at least 1 siva cluster in there btw), and that is when i figured out how the ax could be recharged with fire.

Think of it like a Sword except the normal attack will add 2 if you connect. The power attack uses up 10. If you have a bunch of enemies and take them out with normal attacks instead of one big attack you can recharge a good bit of ammo.

Ah. It never occurred to me to use it on anything except the siva'd lords. :)

I pretty much only used it on the siva'd lords, but I did get 2 ammo for each melee.

The final fight was really fun though.

The final fight was fantastic - and AFTER it was done, I found out (by accident) how to get ammo for the axe. So now I want to run it again, to try it with an axe that actually works. :)

Similar, but, I stumbled on the fact that you could get a little ammo by using the melee button, but I didn't know about standing by the fires (heck, I didn't even see them in the frantic slam-fest that was the final fight) until after the fight was over.

Think of it like a Sword except the normal attack will add 2 if you connect. The power attack uses up 10. If you have a bunch of enemies and take them out with normal attacks instead of one big attack you can recharge a good bit of ammo.

Ah. It never occurred to me to use it on anything except the siva'd lords. :)

The final fight was really fun though.

The final fight was fantastic - and AFTER it was done, I found out (by accident) how to get ammo for the axe. So now I want to run it again, to try it with an axe that actually works. :)

There is actually two ways to get ammo for it. Basic melee'ing a guy gives you 2 ammo and then there is the fire locations.

Wait, what? The only way I finished it was meleeing them (with the axe) - I didn't get any ammo that way!

The final fight was really fun though.

The final fight was fantastic - and AFTER it was done, I found out (by accident) how to get ammo for the axe. So now I want to run it again, to try it with an axe that actually works. :)

There is actually two ways to get ammo for it. Basic melee'ing a guy gives you 2 ammo and then there is the fire locations.

The final fight was really fun though.

The final fight was fantastic - and AFTER it was done, I found out (by accident) how to get ammo for the axe. So now I want to run it again, to try it with an axe that actually works. :)

As I think about it, I'm realizing the the thing that made me like it so much is the way they directly tied the history and lore with your current struggles together. Previous Destiny expansions or sub-plots have tried to do similar things in the past, but I've always found it to be one-sided. We learn a little bit about the history of Crota and the moon, as well as the Fireteam that "went down into the pit", but we never actually see anything tied to that fireteam. We just hear Eris talking about them non-stop.

You interacted with people who had been there before, and left evidence of their presence. There are bodies, scorch marks, and a sense that you're on the trail and catching up. You never do (in time) of course, but the sense of connection was there. Sucks that you can't replay them, they were a real treat.

That was one of the great things about Halo back in the day. Seeing the Lifeboats fly by, finding the crash site, then finding the survivors as they're in the middle of a battle, and working to save enough survivors so that you can rebuild your forces to mount a counter-attack on one of the enemy ships that caused you to evacuate in the first place? Man...

Destiny definitely needs more "things happened here" moments...

I personally thought the still hot cut marks on the walls that carved a path for you at the beginning was a very nice touch. It felt like you were following a giant beast that had cut it's way through the cosmodrome.

The other thing I really wish that Destiny would do is having a feeling of battle between good and evil that is in progress. We get teased about it when we defend a spot waiting for the hawks to bring reinforcements only to find out "Oh, you killed everything? Okay we will just hover here and watch"

I know the AI isn't that great, but frankly I don't care. What I wouldn't give to come upon a couple AI Guardians in a skirmish with some enemies. All we ever get is skirmishes between Enemies. The only fight I see between gaurdians and enemies is either myself or rando's fighting in a public space, which is just a slaughtering ground.

Would love this. I can understand the difficulty of having friendly NPCs in public spaces, but otherwise, why not?

Plotwise, I like the main questline story a lot--like others, I wish it had been a bit longer, but I'm glad it didn't have anything that felt like filler. Most of the missions made me feel like I was doing something new and I especially enjoyed the last one. Any disappointment about the length was offset by the knowledge that The Taken King ended up being much more substantive than I thought it would be with all the quests that unlocked and so far I like the things they are doing that are similar, like using a heretofore multiplayer space for a PVE mission.

Nits and bits I liked

Liked the "young wolf" stuff. It was endearing and the Iron Lords are probably the only characters who can talk about guardians that way.

There were times when it seemed that questions were being addressed to the guardian, but were answered by the ghost. Is "ghostsplaining" a thing? It almost made me long for the "no time to explain" cutscene, where guardians and ghosts at least had a negotiable relationship.

Some lines were fine as written but were delivered awkwardly. Some lines were just bad. "Puppeted" is not a word. Geez, guys. That kind of pissed me off that something that dumb made it in.

In b4 #so-and-sowasright.

More!

It was a great little short story, I was sad it was over so fast. I guess I wanted a novella.

So, the story missions could have been stretched out more, given more tasks to do, more things to investigate and learn. As it stands it was over super quick. I look forward to going back through the story missions with my other characters and taking more time while doing so.

Also, I'm excited to explore the progress book.

I was chatting with Cyber about the story a bit... I really liked it, and couldn't quite put my finger on "why". It's not that it was anything particularly deep or well developed.
As I think about it, I'm realizing the the thing that made me like it so much is the way they directly tied the history and lore with your current struggles together. Previous Destiny expansions or sub-plots have tried to do similar things in the past, but I've always found it to be one-sided. We learn a little bit about the history of Crota and the moon, as well as the Fireteam that "went down into the pit", but we never actually see anything tied to that fireteam. We just hear Eris talking about them non-stop.

I think RoI's story is very similar to the TTK mission where you go down into the Vault of Glass in search of Praedyth. None of Praedyth's story had been mentioned in the game previously, but we knew the name (thanks to the VoG weapons) which helped peak some interest as the missions starts and you first hear his name. As you work your way through, Praedyth's story is uncovered in a way that ties directly to the threat you are currently facing. You learn something about all factions involved, not just the bad guys or just the good guys. I find details like that help make the game-world feel more complete and fleshed out.

Indeed.

I think part of it is that the story of the Iron Lords, all of it is based on Earth and affected Humanity. The Hive? Their story rising form short lived prey to immortals rampaging across the galaxy destroying entire civilizations is awesome, but our Guardians are only affected by the very end of Crota and Oryx's story. Same thing with the Vex, and the Cabal. The Fallen are a little more closely linked to us because of the Awoken and Twilight Gap and their occupation of the Cosmodrome, but event still, they had their entire Golden Age and Whirlwind happen many years ago outside our view.

Maybe a lot of this could be solved with decent cutscenes. Letting every player see Oryx's forces smash civilization after civilization would have made his defeat much more impactful, for instance. Instead we got like one sentence from our Ghost alluding to them destroying thousands of world or whatever...

The Grimoire is great. I love the stories. But exposing those stories in game certainly makes a difference!

Your post just helped something click into place in my mind:

We learn a little about Crota's history in terms of his attack on the moon, but we never learn anything about who he is, how the Hive operate, what it takes to rise to power within their culture, etc (the Taken King takes a couple baby steps in this direction, but very little).

Same with the other factions: pretty much all the player ever learns about them is how they relate as a threat. In some stories, that's ok (Halo CE, for example). But if the enemies are treated as 2-dimensional threats, you really need compelling development on the Hero's side to make up for it; something Destiny clearly lacks.

As basic as it is, the story in RoI is the first time a piece of Destiny content has told a complete narrative. We understand the villains, we're given context through the history of the Iron Lords (which helps establish our own motives), and everything makes sense in the ways it needs to without digging into the grimoire to explain huge plot holes.

As I think about it, I'm realizing the the thing that made me like it so much is the way they directly tied the history and lore with your current struggles together. Previous Destiny expansions or sub-plots have tried to do similar things in the past, but I've always found it to be one-sided. We learn a little bit about the history of Crota and the moon, as well as the Fireteam that "went down into the pit", but we never actually see anything tied to that fireteam. We just hear Eris talking about them non-stop.

You interacted with people who had been there before, and left evidence of their presence. There are bodies, scorch marks, and a sense that you're on the trail and catching up. You never do (in time) of course, but the sense of connection was there. Sucks that you can't replay them, they were a real treat.

That was one of the great things about Halo back in the day. Seeing the Lifeboats fly by, finding the crash site, then finding the survivors as they're in the middle of a battle, and working to save enough survivors so that you can rebuild your forces to mount a counter-attack on one of the enemy ships that caused you to evacuate in the first place? Man...

Destiny definitely needs more "things happened here" moments...

I personally thought the still hot cut marks on the walls that carved a path for you at the beginning was a very nice touch. It felt like you were following a giant beast that had cut it's way through the cosmodrome.

The other thing I really wish that Destiny would do is having a feeling of battle between good and evil that is in progress. We get teased about it when we defend a spot waiting for the hawks to bring reinforcements only to find out "Oh, you killed everything? Okay we will just hover here and watch"

I know the AI isn't that great, but frankly I don't care. What I wouldn't give to come upon a couple AI Guardians in a skirmish with some enemies. All we ever get is skirmishes between Enemies. The only fight I see between gaurdians and enemies is either myself or rando's fighting in a public space, which is just a slaughtering ground.

More!

It was a great little short story, I was sad it was over so fast. I guess I wanted a novella.

So, the story missions could have been stretched out more, given more tasks to do, more things to investigate and learn. As it stands it was over super quick. I look forward to going back through the story missions with my other characters and taking more time while doing so.

Also, I'm excited to explore the progress book.

I was chatting with Cyber about the story a bit... I really liked it, and couldn't quite put my finger on "why". It's not that it was anything particularly deep or well developed.
As I think about it, I'm realizing the the thing that made me like it so much is the way they directly tied the history and lore with your current struggles together. Previous Destiny expansions or sub-plots have tried to do similar things in the past, but I've always found it to be one-sided. We learn a little bit about the history of Crota and the moon, as well as the Fireteam that "went down into the pit", but we never actually see anything tied to that fireteam. We just hear Eris talking about them non-stop.

I think RoI's story is very similar to the TTK mission where you go down into the Vault of Glass in search of Praedyth. None of Praedyth's story had been mentioned in the game previously, but we knew the name (thanks to the VoG weapons) which helped peak some interest as the missions starts and you first hear his name. As you work your way through, Praedyth's story is uncovered in a way that ties directly to the threat you are currently facing. You learn something about all factions involved, not just the bad guys or just the good guys. I find details like that help make the game-world feel more complete and fleshed out.

Indeed.

I think part of it is that the story of the Iron Lords, all of it is based on Earth and affected Humanity. The Hive? Their story rising form short lived prey to immortals rampaging across the galaxy destroying entire civilizations is awesome, but our Guardians are only affected by the very end of Crota and Oryx's story. Same thing with the Vex, and the Cabal. The Fallen are a little more closely linked to us because of the Awoken and Twilight Gap and their occupation of the Cosmodrome, but event still, they had their entire Golden Age and Whirlwind happen many years ago outside our view.

Maybe a lot of this could be solved with decent cutscenes. Letting every player see Oryx's forces smash civilization after civilization would have made his defeat much more impactful, for instance. Instead we got like one sentence from our Ghost alluding to them destroying thousands of world or whatever...

The Grimoire is great. I love the stories. But exposing those stories in game certainly makes a difference!

As I think about it, I'm realizing the the thing that made me like it so much is the way they directly tied the history and lore with your current struggles together. Previous Destiny expansions or sub-plots have tried to do similar things in the past, but I've always found it to be one-sided. We learn a little bit about the history of Crota and the moon, as well as the Fireteam that "went down into the pit", but we never actually see anything tied to that fireteam. We just hear Eris talking about them non-stop.

You interacted with people who had been there before, and left evidence of their presence. There are bodies, scorch marks, and a sense that you're on the trail and catching up. You never do (in time) of course, but the sense of connection was there. Sucks that you can't replay them, they were a real treat.

That was one of the great things about Halo back in the day. Seeing the Lifeboats fly by, finding the crash site, then finding the survivors as they're in the middle of a battle, and working to save enough survivors so that you can rebuild your forces to mount a counter-attack on one of the enemy ships that caused you to evacuate in the first place? Man...

Destiny definitely needs more "things happened here" moments...

More!

It was a great little short story, I was sad it was over so fast. I guess I wanted a novella.

So, the story missions could have been stretched out more, given more tasks to do, more things to investigate and learn. As it stands it was over super quick. I look forward to going back through the story missions with my other characters and taking more time while doing so.

Also, I'm excited to explore the progress book.

I was chatting with Cyber about the story a bit... I really liked it, and couldn't quite put my finger on "why". It's not that it was anything particularly deep or well developed.
As I think about it, I'm realizing the the thing that made me like it so much is the way they directly tied the history and lore with your current struggles together. Previous Destiny expansions or sub-plots have tried to do similar things in the past, but I've always found it to be one-sided. We learn a little bit about the history of Crota and the moon, as well as the Fireteam that "went down into the pit", but we never actually see anything tied to that fireteam. We just hear Eris talking about them non-stop.

I think RoI's story is very similar to the TTK mission where you go down into the Vault of Glass in search of Praedyth. None of Praedyth's story had been mentioned in the game previously, but we knew the name (thanks to the VoG weapons) which helped peak some interest as the missions starts and you first hear his name. As you work your way through, Praedyth's story is uncovered in a way that ties directly to the threat you are currently facing. You learn something about all factions involved, not just the bad guys or just the good guys. I find details like that help make the game-world feel more complete and fleshed out.